BSMS 86 - Video in B2B SaaS marketing

Brian Graf: Welcome to episode 87 of B2B SaaS Marketing Snacks. I'm Brian Graf. I'm the CEO of Kalungi, and today I'm here with Julian Revorio, one of Kalungi’s marketing leaders who's led multiple marketing teams and now drives growth for multiple clients day to day. In this episode, we're diving into a topic that's more tactical than usual, but critical to how B2B SaaS companies can and should be using video in their marketing.

We unpack why video is not just a nice to have anymore, but an essential tool for grabbing attention, building trust, and driving conversion, especially in an age where your buyers are consuming more and more content in short form video than ever before. Julian shares his insights on what kinds of video formats perform best, how AI tools have drastically lowered the barrier to entry and the surprising impact video can have on your cost per lead.

Sometimes cutting it down by 30% or more. We also touch on TikTok, AI generated avatars and the importance of balancing short form video for awareness with longer form video for deeper funnel stages. Let's get into it.

Brian Graf: Julian, why don't you just introduce yourself. Tell us about your relationship with marketing over the years and, and why this topic is important to you. 

Julian Revorio: Sure. No, first thanks for having me here, Brian, and yeah, I can give you a very brief introduction of me. I have been working on marketing for the past seven, almost eight years, and most of it has been in the tech side, obviously digital marketing and I've been in B2B SaaS for, for quite a while now. I've worked with two different companies that went through YC trying to grow those companies. And I joined Kalungi a little bit more than a year and a half ago. Pretty happy and, you know, just growing B2B SaaS companies also through video, which is one of the most important topics for me.

As you said, if you're listening to this and you haven't done any video content for your B2B SaaS startup company or whatever stage you are at, you are very behind. Just think about what, or how you consume content. You know? You're probably on TikTok, you're probably on Instagram reels.

You probably watch YouTube constantly and then Yeah. Well, that's, that's where everything is. So if you're not there. The chances are that you're not getting seen. 

Brian Graf: Yeah. You gotta get there. I think just to frame the conversation for some of our listeners. Like about 95% of B2B buyers say that video plays a role in moving forward with the purchase decision.

You know, we are, we are in, I would say, the most critical time to use video, but also at the same time it's the easiest time to use video. Right? And so the time, it is kind of the perfect time to get on board. In B2B SaaS, we're working with the most educated buyer market of all time.

Every decision maker has multiple touchpoints with each brand, multiple conversations with each brand before making a decision. And then not to mention all the internal conversations that have to go on particularly with higher value ACVs average contract values. And so video does play a critical role in this.

Also, to your point, Julian, just think about the way that you consume information. The amount of texts that you read versus video that you watch, whether it's on TikTok or Instagram or Facebook even, right. Video is the format. It's more engaging. It conveys information better.

Right. And it's just the way that people consume information nowadays, then just a couple more stats, right, in terms of, of adoption of video and how to use it for yourself with AI tools. Now, you know, editing has been reduced by about 50%.

And then finally, you know, so it's, it's much easier to produce video yourself. And honestly, the expectation has shifted. I feel like five plus years ago, video was just this big thing. You had to have studios and cameras on site and huge editing teams to be able to produce anything. And it was a big lift.

And so it could be very daunting for companies to do for the first time. And now the expectation is different. It's low production value can be on your phone. And still have 95% of the effectiveness as these high budget films, high budget ads or high budget videos.

So. Anyway, again, we didn't come here to listen to me talk, but just to just to frame the conversation, I think it's really important to have. I'm happy you're here. 

Julian Revorio: You touched on very, very important points Brian there, because especially, and I think one of the easiest ways for people to understand the importance of video is how easy it is to get it today.

You know, no one's expecting this tool from a startup, and that's, mm-hmm. That's probably what we're gonna talk about today, but yeah. 

Brian Graf: Absolutely. Let's just start with maybe let's just start with what you're seeing as the, the biggest problem with a lot of B2B SaaS content and, and its effectiveness. Both in both in format, right. And obviously if it, if it's not video. How, how it should be video, but also just, you know, the purpose of content in marketing is to resonate with the viewer. And your target audience. And what have you seen, both with the clients that you've worked with, but also the companies that you've worked with in the past where that was keeping companies from.

Communicating really effectively with clients and processes? 

Julian Revorio: First Brian, I think like B2B sales, marketing content has been mainly static and like long form, maybe blogs, maybe eBooks, maybe case studies depending on the company, you know? Mm-hmm. And. Even though those are still, you know, effective blog posts are important for SEO.

And now with AI, those blog posts can help you like, get positioned on, on different AI tools, just like a search and chat GPT. But ultimately whenever you go on social media, you're seeing videos like and, and more importantly, it's short form videos. It's, like the way people who are consuming just content in general is shifting towards a more short, quick engaging format.

And, that shift, I think the B2B SaaS industry has been a little bit behind because, you know, for example, TikTok is obviously a huge social network. A little bit controversial, but like, we cannot deny that we have effective, like millions and millions and millions of users, you know?

Mm-hmm. And that maybe a lot of your clients are in TikTok, you know? But why are, like, why aren't we doing it? It is looked at as a social network that's guided towards probably the younger generation, stuff like that. But I think that's, that's the thought of the past.

No, I don't think that's valid anymore because with TikTok it came with YouTube shorts and it came with an Instagram reel. So everywhere you are, you're gonna get video content, you know, and vertical short form video. And if your audience is there, if your audience is consuming that, it just makes sense that you start getting into it and, and B2B SaaS companies, it's a, it's a, it's a, it's a greenfield for me, like, and I'm seeing it with, with some of our clients. I'm gonna tell, I'm gonna talk about that in, a little bit. But it's a greenfield, like, it's, it's, it's an oasis where you start.

Positioning yourself via video, via like innovative content that, that some other, or maybe your competitors are not doing, or probably your competitors are not doing. If you go to everything that your competitors are putting out, it's probably not short form video, short form, vertical videos, you know?

Mm-hmm. So, if. So it's a great time for B2B SaaS companies to, to get into it, start getting used to it. Like if you need to hire someone, hire someone. But it's like it's a shift that it's a shift that's happening. It's a shift that just as we move away from other social media platforms to LinkedIn.

Then we started to use LinkedIn and everything is now going on through LinkedIn. We are moving now to grabbing attention through short form, you know, through that content. And that's something that we cannot deny. And well, for your second part of the question, which was how am I seeing that across company clients?

It's well. As, as you can see, it's important for me, and I'm seeing that trend going on. So every, every time I'm working with a client here at Kalungi. One of my first approaches is, are we doing video? If not, why? Why aren't we doing it? And if we are, how can we get better? No. Mm-hmm. And, and most of it, like most of our clients have, see, have been seeing, like very profitable results just by switching to video, you know, because you're seeing that it doesn't take that much, you know? Well, for us here in Kalungi, we have a video team that's very talented. So, you know, we use it and, and I use it a lot. But if you don't have a video team, you can start it yourself.

Brian Graf: Well, and again, with the earlier stat. AI tools are everywhere around video and maybe it won't be as good. But it could be whatever, 50%, 80% is good. And you could do it yourself and it'd be fine. I think that, what you talked about, two things that stood out about what you said. One is that the nice, the nice thing question mark about B2B SaaS marketing is that it does lag behind.

It tends to lag behind B2C marketing. And so you don't need to be on the bleeding edge of video or any marketing technology. But the nice thing is that if you are in B2B SaaS marketing, you can do something like introduce video as a content play or an ads play, and you will likely be in many markets and in many industries like the first, you'll still likely be the first to do it right.

Or have at least an advantage over your competition because B2B Marketing has such a tendency to just focus on, like you said, blogs and written content, and maybe they're getting into organic social right now. Right? There are many B2B companies who undervalue I guess marketing. And so if you are able to put in play video effectively, it gives you a huge leg up.

You did bring up TikTok and I think you made the point correctly. I, I do. I hear companies say like, well, why aren't, why, why aren't we on TikTok? We should be on TikTok. And sometimes that's the right thing to say and, and to look at, but often it's not. It's not. But that being said, it's not an issue of is that format the right format? It is. Is your audience on TikTok? Right? And can you target them effectively on TikTok? Yeah. So a hundred percent agree with that. 

Julian Revorio: No, and, and as I was saying, like TikTok, it, even, even though it's meant for, for a younger generation, it, it came here to change what other platforms are doing.

Mm-hmm. You know, so, so even if you're not a fan of TikTok, even if you're not on TikTok. Like, you can get a lot of inspiration and, and, and knowledge about how to run short form videos and yeah, short form video content from, from TikTok. Yeah. 

Brian Graf: Yeah. I mean, I was, as you were talking, trying to think in my head the last time that I read a newsletter front to back, and I cannot remember the same thing with a blog unless I'm deeply, deeply researching something.

Which I think says a lot based on, you know, the amount of videos. And probably the last time you watched a two minute video was like, probably today, like this morning, you know, and a hundred percent. So what have you seen? Do you have any you're talking about you, you can go into like Kalungi clients generally or other companies that you've worked with.

What have you seen across, you know, those clients in terms of the benefits that video has brought? Can you give me any kind of case studies in terms of campaigns that you are running or engagement that you saw or anything like that? 

Julian Revorio: Yeah, well with the clients I manage, I've seen impressive numbers.

You know one of our clients is in the contractor space and we started implementing a video format to our ads. You know, it's like a contractor industry, very easy to get people on Facebook, for example, or, or, or Instagram. So it's one of those small niche markets that, for B2B, still still work for those.

And when, like, when I took over, I saw that the ads weren't bad. I gathered the theme and I, the team and I, and I said, you know what, if we just turn our static ads and our static ideas into video and, and see what happens, and after testing, I saw that the cost per lead dropped by 30%.

You know, and immediately it was a no brainer. Well, we, mm-hmm. We are no longer doing static images. We're doing all the videos. And since then I've, I've tested more than 50 videos just with that account. And, and while I can share with you some of my learnings, no our learnings have been that testimonials, like short form testimonials, real people talking to a camera and saying, mm-hmm I like this platform because it helped me do X, y, Z in less than a minute, maybe a minute and a half.

Those are very well performing, also very short demo videos that go straight to the point that can show value very quickly. Those perform very well. And also just creative stuff that can jump the screen, things that you have, you're not used to seeing on the B2B side, but can like, have cliffhangers and can just grab your attention quickly.

Again, a minimum of more than a half, maybe 30 seconds. Just go straight to the 0.1 phrase very quickly, show your product. Those three have, have been the three types of videos that have worked for us and the top of the funnel. And well, we are just constantly lowering our cost per lead by testing new videos and going through that.

And that's just one example and that's just one example specifically on the paid side, you know? Mm-hmm. But I've seen a lot of companies start implementing. And, here's a good example on why just using video is easy, you know, and why the skews of making video is hard is no longer like it's no longer valid.

I've seen a lot of companies on LinkedIn, just their founder or their CPO or stuff like that, just film a video with their face right there showing their product or something they're launching. And those videos perform at least two times better than a written post or an image post, like a carousel.

So it's those kinds of things that I'm seeing with our clients. And well, there's a lot of use cases and, and case studies from. Like different parts of the funnel, and I think we're gonna dive deeper into that later. But yeah, those are just numbers that can make like, it's impressive.

Like if you're listening to this, imagine that, that all of a sudden your cost per lead on your LinkedIn ads or your Meta ads drops by 30%. Like, how much can you do with that? It's amazing. 

Brian Graf: Yeah. And just almost with a snap of a finger. Right? A couple things that really resonated with me on that.

It is just taking a step back. Right. What you're talking about doesn't require a strategic shift right. At all. Exactly. Exactly. It takes the exact same messaging, the exact same value props that you've already established, that you know, work and just makes them better. But what you were saying in terms of the types of videos that seem to work particularly on the paid side.

Going when you're saying, Hey, some of the creative stuff that we did and that, that just pops off the screen, that's basically like. It's basically engaging content. Like how can you pull people out of stasis and get them to look at your demos, how? Basically answer the question of like, Hey, how does this product actually work?

And testimonials are, does this actually work for someone like me? And all of those categories or a, they're critical in the decision process, but B there, there's no way that text would do better than video in all three of those categories. Video is a hundred percent. It conveys, and that's really what marketing is at the end of the day.

It's not about really high, high production value or really fancy content or wording. It's like, how can you communicate the value of something really effectively? How can you, it's, it all goes back to, you know, why change? Why with me, why now? Right? But how can you communicate those things as effectively and simply as possible?

And video is honestly the way to go. And, and to your point, right on the Loom video, it doesn't need to be high. I value it can just be, it can take a founder a minute, 30 seconds to do. 

Julian Revorio: Just start putting your side, your face out there, you start getting more credibility.

It's a win-win by the brand in, in different parts, you know? Absolutely. And just following up on something you said, like it's kinda low cost. 'cause like, well, for us, we've tested more than 50 videos. Yeah. It takes time and effort to, to build these videos and also, you know, money to test in, in, in Meta and LinkedIn, et cetera.

But once you find something that works, you just exploit it. And, and for us, like mm-hmm. Another case, one of the videos that work, that just went half of the, like our, our, our MQLs coming from that video are half the price than, for example, a demo video that worked already 30% below a static image, you know?

Mm-hmm. And one of those was one that took probably two days. Yeah. From idea to production? No. And that one you could, is the best performing one. 

Brian Graf: If you could decrease your cost per click in two days by 30%, why would you not? Exactly. Yeah. No. So let's talk about format for a sec. You know, you've talked about that short term, short form, vertical format.

Is there anything else that people should be thinking about when producing these videos that you think really hooks viewers or makes them more effective? 

Julian Revorio: Well I like to see it as a compromise. And the compromise is very clear. When, when, when you're scrolling, when you have your phone in the vertical position, the compromise to watch a two minute two minute video is very low.

You know? Mm-hmm. You can, you can do it in the bathroom, you can do it walking your dog or anywhere. Do it anywhere. Yeah. Like between meetings. Like, there's, there's a lot of points in your day where you can watch a short form vertical video. This one, honestly, for me, is more top of the funnel.

It's more you're discovering something, you're grabbing the attention of someone for a minute, two minutes, maybe three minutes. But that's only if you're actually creating something that's very, very engaging. Mm-hmm. And that's how I like to see it now, long form it's the other side of the commitment, like you're committing to putting your, your phone or, or opening it in, in a computer, but putting your phone in a horizontal position that video occupying all of your screen, it's probably gonna be 20 minutes, maybe 10 minutes, maybe 45 minutes. You don't know.

Maybe it's a recording of a webinar, so it's an hour, an hour long. Mm-hmm. You know, and those take a lot of commitment. And if someone's gonna actually commit to watching a video like that, it's because you need to deliver very, very high value. You know, something that obviously in the short term video, you're not gonna be able to communicate.

And if someone's gonna commit to that, they're probably lowering the funnel. You know, they're considering, they're about to make a decision towards your company or another company, and they're gonna invest a big chunk of money for the next year on your platform, then yeah, that commitment doesn't sound so bad, you know?

Mm-hmm. I'm gonna spend 45 minutes watching and understanding this platform versus just making a decision out of thin air, you know? And. That's how I like to think about the format. It's not like we were really talking and, and hyping the short form versions. No, that's a great balance.

But yeah, the long form version actually works a lot, you know, and the horizontal format is, it's, it's very good for training. It's very good for the customer journey or in your funnel, like through consideration all the way down to retention. You're probably gonna push horizontal format and, and long form format. No, just because those people are gonna pay the money. But you probably got them through a short video on LinkedIn, you know? Yeah. That's, and that's how I like to see it. 

Brian Graf: Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense, honestly. One of my favorite B2B SaaS marketing influencers, Dave Gerhardt, back probably five years ago, he had a Patreon account that I subscribed to, and his format was he'd be like walking his dog and he would just like have his phone and it wouldn't even be video, it would just be audio, but it would just be him spewing his thoughts into the phone.

There would be ums and ahs and it wasn't really edited, but the content was valuable. Right. And it was a bite-sized chunk that was educational and delivered value. Right. And that was fantastic. Right. And even, even now, he'll do selfie videos or, or things like that that are short form.

Perfect. Top of funnel content. But to your point, right, like before investing heavily in, if you're an educated buyer before you invest heavily in anything right? You're likely gonna be watching a video on it if it's important. Yeah. And that, that long form video does absolutely need to bring that real value, 

Julian Revorio: definitely no.

And, and, and that those are the ones that take a little bit more production, everything, but mm-hmm. But sometimes it doesn't. Like sometimes it's a webinar that you record and, and you have it available. Sometimes it's a demo that like your best salesman. A hundred percent. Yeah. Can, can, can present.

And that's it. You know. 

Brian Graf: I was gonna say, I mean, just because we're saying high value does not mean that it couldn't be recorded in a loom. Or is a screen recording. Exactly, but what it has to be is really polished and relevant and drives value for the reader or I guess the viewer in this, in this point.

Julian Revorio: Yeah. No, and, and, and, well, I can, like, for, for our listeners, I can, I, I can give you guys some AI platforms that you can start using. Yeah, please. Because I tested all of these and all of them are for different purposes, but there's two that are pretty similar.

One's called Synthesia and the other one's HeyGen. So Synthesia and HeyGen, what they do is they like, they create an AI avatar, you could say, that's presenting something. So you have the AI avatar on one side and a screen on the other side. So you just give them the script. You pick the avatar and the images or gifs or videos that you want to go along with what they're saying.

Yeah. And now you have a five, six, maybe 10 minute video about your product with an avatar and everything. That one, you didn't pay for someone to actually film it. Mm-hmm. You didn't record it 'cause it's high. It's like high quality recording and. And, and you just need to edit it, and you don't even need an Adobe Premiere or anything like that.

It's very easy, you know? Yeah. So Synthesia and HeyGen both both work for that. And there's one, one other that's called Clip Champ, which is from Microsoft. And, and that one's more for editing like very traditional editing. It can, it can help you like. Lower the volume if it's very high, automatically transcript, eh, just do a ton of stuff that you would, that, that would take maybe an hour, two hours, they can do it in five minutes and, and it's very easy to, to use and edit the, with, with, with those platforms and.

And the last one is called InVideo. Mm. And that, and that one also creates AI footage. You know, it is still looks like AI, but you can test it. Like you, like, honestly, as I said, like with one account, we've tested more than 50 videos. We've tested everything.

You don't know what's gonna work for you and some, something may work, so you just try it. And if it's gonna take 45 minutes of, of a day. To put something together, like take the time, use it, and see what's, see what happens. Why would, mm-hmm. 

Brian Graf: Yeah. Some audiences may be turned off by something like an AI video, but others probably won't.

And honestly, the further along we go, probably the less and less people will care.

Julian Revorio: And the great thing about this is anywhere you publish those videos, you're gonna get metrics. You're gonna, you're gonna get numbers, you know, you're gonna see whatever happens and you're gonna learn. And yeah, like sometimes, like I push my team to not be so detail oriented.

Sometimes a subtitle could have a, a typo and mm-hmm. Between feedback and, and I see, I, I watch the video or, or someone reviews the video says, oh, this has a typo. And then by the next day it's corrected. And then we review it again. It delays and, and now instead of publishing it on Monday, you're, you're publishing it on Thursday or Friday?

No. Right. Launch it with the typo and usually it doesn't matter, like the data says it doesn't matter. 

Brian Graf: No. As long as you're, yeah. As long as you're staying close and odd and iterating often, then yeah, it's absolutely worth it. Exactly. Okay. Well, unfortunately I have to run, but this has been fantastic.

Thank you so much, Julian. For the recommendations, the strategy. I think this is great. And honestly, probably just the tip of the iceberg so we can talk lots more on this, but it's huge. It's huge. But I appreciate your time and yeah, thanks so much. 

Julian Revorio: No thanks to you, Brian, and well, if, if someone listening has questions or, or wants to talk about this, at some point you can reach out to me on LinkedIn.

It's probably in the description. You're gonna see how it's written. It's a tricky one. 

Brian Graf: Awesome. 

Julian Revorio: Yeah. Thanks again, 

Brian Graf: I really appreciate you, sir. Thank you to the Kalungi team for helping us make this whole thing work and of course, you for choosing to spend your time with us.

As a reminder, all the links we mentioned in this episode can be found in the show notes, and if you wanna submit or vote on a question you'd like us to answer, you can do that at Kalungi.com/podcast. Every time we record, we take one of the top three topics and jam on it.

Thanks again.

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